National Insurance credits for Family members who care for a child

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Re: National Insurance credits for Family members who care for a child

Postby jaytee » Sat Jan 21, 2017 7:32 am

Someone born after 06 April 1978 cannot claim their State Retirement Pension until their 68th birthday. They could have statrted work at age 16 and therefore have a potential to pay NI for 52 years, but only need 30 years to quality for a full pension. I assume the additional 22 years they pay-in directly or indirectly fund the credits that others receive.

But this means it would be possible for someone to come to the UK for the first time at age 38, work until they are 68 years and get a full pension based on paying their 30 years of contribtions.

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Re: National Insurance credits for Family members who care for a child

Postby planteria » Sat Jan 21, 2017 8:18 am

Derbiean wrote:You simply cannot come to the UK and get a free pension its not how the eligibility criteria works, the same criteria applies to UK citizens.


i understand your logic, but this has certainly been happening in recent years. perhaps the system has been/is being tightened up.

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Re: National Insurance credits for Family members who care for a child

Postby Pandora » Sat Jan 21, 2017 8:31 am

jaytee wrote:Someone born after 06 April 1978 cannot claim their State Retirement Pension until their 68th birthday. They could have statrted work at age 16 and therefore have a potential to pay NI for 52 years, but only need 30 years to quality for a full pension. I assume the additional 22 years they pay-in directly or indirectly fund the credits that others receive. ...


You now need 35 years to qualify for the full basic state pension.

It is very likely that the State Pension age will rise in the near future. There is a review due in May 2017. I'd expect to see it rise to 69. Higher in the long term.

There is a National Insurance Fund; it receives £86 bn of NI contributions and pays out £89 bn of state pensions. (Amongst other things). The Treasury is topping up the fund at the moment.

jaytee wrote:...But this means it would be possible for someone to come to the UK for the first time at age 38, work until they are 68 years and get a full pension based on paying their 30 years of contribtions.


Is that a bad thing? What do you want to do about it?

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Re: National Insurance credits for Family members who care for a child

Postby planteria » Sat Jan 21, 2017 9:11 am

i assume that we all agree that if someone comes to the UK and puts in their full quota they are entitled to receive the fsp.

Pandora wrote:There is a National Insurance Fund; it receives £86 bn of NI contributions and pays out £89 bn of state pensions. (Amongst other things). The Treasury is topping up the fund at the moment.


..hence the cuts, including raising the age at which it pays out. it's frustrating to see the finish line moved back, but it is inevitable when so much public money has been wasted.

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Re: National Insurance credits for Family members who care for a child

Postby William Joseph » Sat Jan 21, 2017 9:34 am

planteria wrote:i assume that we all agree that if someone comes to the UK and puts in their full quota they are entitled to receive the fsp.

Pandora wrote:There is a National Insurance Fund; it receives £86 bn of NI contributions and pays out £89 bn of state pensions. (Amongst other things). The Treasury is topping up the fund at the moment.


..hence the cuts, including raising the age at which it pays out. it's frustrating to see the finish line moved back, but it is inevitable when so much public money has been wasted.

I think it is quite clear that no one can claim a State Pension without having paid into it as there is a minimum of 30 years National Insurance credits required.

The reason that cuts are being made and the age is being raised, Is because we have an aging population and therefore people are living longer. Also because successive governments have failed to plan for this. In the same way that they have failed to plan for the NHS and Social Care.
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Re: National Insurance credits for Family members who care for a child

Postby expressman33 » Sat Jan 21, 2017 10:13 am

William Joseph wrote:I think it is quite clear that no one can claim a State Pension without having paid into it as there is a minimum of 30 years National Insurance credits required.


The minimum is now 10 years ( which qualifies for the minimum payment)

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Re: National Insurance credits for Family members who care for a child

Postby expressman33 » Sat Jan 21, 2017 10:21 am


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Re: National Insurance credits for Family members who care for a child

Postby Pandora » Sun Jan 22, 2017 7:33 am

William Joseph wrote:...I think it is quite clear that no one can claim a State Pension without having paid into it as there is a minimum of 30 years National Insurance credits required.


The new State Pension works on the basis that you need a minimum of 10 "qualifying years" to get anything (as already stated) and at least 35 "qualifying years" to get the maximum. A qualifying year means that you have either paid NI contributions or received NI credits for that year.

There are a number of ways of getting NI credits, such as being a family member who cares for a child (which prompted this thread) or being unemployed, or receiving working tax credits - there are a number of things. Plus of course you, you could work part- time (or whatever) earning an amount above the Lower Earnings Limit but below the Primary Threshold, and you would not pay any NI, but it still counts as a qualifying year.

It would therefore be quite possible for someone to qualify for even the maximum new State Pension without having actually paid anything at all. I'd imagine there are at least some people to whom this applies.

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Re: National Insurance credits for Family members who care for a child

Postby planteria » Sun Jan 22, 2017 8:30 am

good points Pandora.
the aging population is the source of the problem, it could be argued.. but of course, if finances permitted, the successive governments could choose to continue to push money into the system to pay the state pension at the existing retirement age if they wanted to do so.
and there people receiving the full state pension that have done no paid work, at all, in the UK.. as Pandora refers to, and also some who have not even been living in the UK during their working life, therefore not putting in any 'qualifying years' either.
i'm not suggesting that this is right, but it is certainly true.

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Re: National Insurance credits for Family members who care for a child

Postby macliam » Sun Jan 22, 2017 9:49 am

planteria wrote:i don't mind how many you consider to be "a lot". the point is that people have arrived in the UK and been awarded a full state pension. so people who have lived here all of their lives and contributed, as referenced in this thread, are at least equally entitled to receive the state pension that our taxes fund.

I'd really like to know how all these foreigners supposedly suck all the money from the system.

My wife entered the UK legally on a marriage visa (because the Portuguese did not get immediate entry privileges at that time). Then, after the marriage and qualifying time she got her "right to remain" papers from Croydon. She has never had "paid employment' in the UK but has worked with various charities whilst looking after our home. Therefore she has ben "covered" by my contributions over the last 27 years.

Then comes the "offer" to allow me to use part of her tax allowance..... BUT, for this she needs a NI number and can't get one because she isn't working! So, how would she get a pension?
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