Brexit

Topical debate, moral dilemmas and quirky questions. Join fellow shareholders in civilised discussions of issues of interest
blythburgh
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Re: Brexit

Post by blythburgh » Fri Nov 08 2019 10:04am

Expresso shops at Waitrose but photoshopped the picture
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Sarah
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Re: Brexit

Post by Sarah » Fri Nov 08 2019 10:18am

Boris Johnson describes how great the withdrawal agreement is for Northern Ireland because it remains so much closer to the EU... too bad the whole UK isn't so fortunate; if only there were some way for the UK to be an EU member and enjoy such benefits... :roll:
https://twitter.com/AdamBienkov/status/ ... 82208?s=20
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blythburgh
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Re: Brexit

Post by blythburgh » Fri Nov 08 2019 12:37pm

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/b ... ailsignout

And this man was voted in by a few thousand people to be our PM. Maybe a General Election is not such a bad idea after all
Keep smiling because the light at the end of someone's tunnel may be you, Ron Cheneler

expressman33
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Re: Brexit

Post by expressman33 » Mon Nov 11 2019 8:29am

Great news that British Steel will be saved. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-50369413

parchedpeas
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Re: Brexit

Post by parchedpeas » Mon Nov 11 2019 9:05am

expressman33 wrote:
Mon Nov 11 2019 8:29am
Great news that British Steel will be saved. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-50369413
Dragged into receivership by Brexit and then sold super cheap to a foreign company. It's good news, of course, but it's a net loss compared to where it was 4 years.

A Brexit parable, that will be repeated over and over again.
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expressman33
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Re: Brexit

Post by expressman33 » Mon Nov 11 2019 9:08am

expressman33 wrote:
Mon Nov 11 2019 8:29am
Great news that British Steel will be saved. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-50369413
The UK steel industry has been in decline for some time because of a variety of factors such as overcapacity in EU steelmaking and Chinese state-subsidised firms flooding the global market with cheap product

The official stance is that British Steel and its bank lenders wanted the government to lend the company £30m on terms that were not commercial, which would have been unlawful under EU state aid rule

blythburgh
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Re: Brexit

Post by blythburgh » Mon Nov 11 2019 10:30am

The company has lost orders because of the uncertainty caused by brexit.
Keep smiling because the light at the end of someone's tunnel may be you, Ron Cheneler

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Re: Brexit

Post by macliam » Mon Nov 11 2019 10:39am

Why would this government care about "EU state aid rules"? I'd like to see whether Germany or France would take the same stance. Sounds like the same old excuse being trotted out to me....
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Richard Frost
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Re: Brexit

Post by Richard Frost » Mon Nov 11 2019 11:01am

parchedpeas wrote:
Mon Nov 11 2019 9:05am
expressman33 wrote:
Mon Nov 11 2019 8:29am
Great news that British Steel will be saved. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-50369413
Dragged into receivership by Brexit and then sold super cheap to a foreign company. It's good news, of course, but it's a net loss compared to where it was 4 years.

A Brexit parable, that will be repeated over and over again.
My understanding is that this has nothing to do with Brexit, but has more to do with the over capacity in the market generally caused by the Chinese dumping steel in markets around the world. Good luck to them if they feel they can make a go of it.

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Re: Brexit

Post by Chadwick » Mon Nov 11 2019 11:27am

The EU State Aid issue is misleading. The rules do prohibit governments propping up companies that would otherwise fail (Italy and Belgium have fallen foul of this.) Unless it is of strategic national importance, eg. for defence. And arguably, steel is essential for our railways and warships amongst other things.

Similar rules apply outside the EU, under WTO terms. Airbus was recently found to have been illegally subsidised.

So you can't blame the EU for stopping us from supporting our own steel industry. The reasons why the UK government declined to offer a £30m bailout are open to speculation. Maybe they were nervous of investing in the same parent company that had lost Comet and Monarch Airlines and had no experience of managing heavy industry. Maybe it was just politics.

Ironically, our imminent departure from the EU meant British Steel no longer qualified for credits on the EU's carbon emissions offset scheme, which landed British Steel with a £120m bill, which the UK taxpayer did pick up.


Brexit uncertainty may have been the final nail in the coffin, but the steel industry in Britain has been in decline for decades. In the 60s, we were the second largest producer in Europe. Other countries protected or nurtured their manufacturing industries. The UK left them to fight for themselves in the free market economy. Our relatively high energy, property and labour costs did not help. It was losing money by the 1970s, years before before it was privatised.

The EU did take steps to impose tariffs on steel coming in from outside the EU (as high as 85% in some cases).

If we leave with no deal, British Steel would immediately be subject to 25% tariffs on most of their sales. There won't be many additional opportunities that we don't have now - WTO terms are generally 0% for steel, so we gain nothing from being outside the EU.
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