Another cashback site starts offering shares (sort of)

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Another cashback site starts offering shares (sort of)

Post by richard@imutual » Wed Dec 19, 2012 5:56 pm

Bigcrumbs is a long-established cashback site that has just announced that, in the event that it is bought by another company, it will share the proceeds with its members. Sound familiar?

Before you get too excited :crazy: there are some significant differences to imutual

Firstly, they seem to be predominantly US-based. According to their site:
BigCrumbs.com generates millions of dollars in revenue each month, serves a constantly expanding member base, and is one of the top loyalty programs in the United States.
They claim to also service other countries, including the UK and Ireland, but I can't really work out how to access UK offers :?

Their new initiative is called Crumbshares, which they explain thus:
Each time you earn cash back through BigCrumbs, you'll also earn an equivalent number of CrumbShares..... In the event that BigCrumbs is acquired by another company, you may redeem your CrumbShares for a percentage of the cash compensation that BigCrumbs receives. The percentage that you will earn is based on the percentage of all CrumbShares that you own.
Sounds a bit like imutual, doesn't it? Except that they're not offering real "shares" (or "stock" as they say across the Atlantic). From the T&Cs:
CrumbShares are not options, securities or equities, are non-transferrable and have no monetary value.
US regulations make it much trickier to give away 'real' shares. To quote the owner:
not quite ownership. We have to be careful with that word per securities regulations. Plus, you'd have to pay taxes immediately if they were actual stock or options!
As a consequence, you don't get any true ownership or control of the company i.e. members don't have any additional influence over what the company does. Compare that with imutual where you can vote for directors and on resolutions, have an automatic right to see audited accounts and ask questions etc.

"So what?" you might say. "I'm just interested in getting a payout once they sell up". Ah but you have no say in whether to accept such an offer. And the lack of true shareholder rights could actually affect how much you receive. I've seen many of these "pseudo-share" schemes before and they have a habit of unravelling (or being purposely 'circumvented') before any sale is achieved. I don't doubt that in this instance the owners have perfectly good intentions, but here's an example of how things might not work out as the members expect.

The T&Cs state:
BigCrumbs.com will set aside fifty percent (50%) of the net cash proceeds (minus associated legal and other expenses) to be shared among members who hold CrumbShares.
Now, you might ask questions about exactly what constitutes "legal and other expenses", what happens to "unclaimed amounts" linked with inactive accounts and whether staff also hold "CrumbShares". But I reckon the biggest likely impact is around the phrase "net cash proceeds". The T&Cs later expand on this:
You understand that the CrumbShares program represents only an agreement between you and BigCrumbs.com that provides you with a claim to a certain percentage, as set forth herein, of the net cash (not stock) proceeds of a completed purchase of BigCrumbs.com.
An offer for this company is likely to consist partly (and possibly wholly) of shares in the acquiring company. e.g. if Facebook buys them, the owner might be offered $Xm of Facebook shares and NO CASH. That would mean no payout for members. Though of course the acquirer would need to factor in the bad will that would generate, so a mixture of cash and shares is more likely. But as you are not true shareholders you have no right to be told the details of the deal; you may just be told how much net cash is involved

So unlike imutual (which guarantees its members 90% of ALL the proceeds of any sale), this site is offering its members at most 50% of the "net cash" element and with little control over the terms or acceptance of such an offer.

But having said that, it does seem to be a genuine offer and it's encouraging to see a site similar to ours embracing the "Members deserve a share of the company" concept. Interesting times... ;)
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Re: Another cashback site starts offering shares (sort of)

Post by jackee069 » Wed Dec 19, 2012 11:36 pm

Not to sound bitter or anything but at the end of the day - the only one who wins is the one who sets up the site etc .... and good luck to them

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Re: Another cashback site starts offering shares (sort of)

Post by richard@imutual » Thu Dec 20, 2012 8:32 am

jackee069 wrote:the only one who wins is the one who sets up the site etc
Well, that's the situation that imutual has set out to change ;)
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Re: Another cashback site starts offering shares (sort of)

Post by Squire » Thu Dec 20, 2012 3:01 pm

Thanks for the info Richard.

Mind if some of us join and see what is what?

Doubt they would pay for doing an offer as much as imutual do, so no worries about them poaching us imutual members for good, away from imutual.

I could be cheeky and ask why this is not in the Paid for Actions topic, since it has "your" referral link in it, but I might be skating too near thin ice if I did that. So I definitely had not better say "why not, most other junk seems to be moved/dumped there lately".

But I meander...

I have just joined, so you should see me as a referral.

Now comes the interesting part.

If this was in the PFA section, I could paste my referral link no problem.

(link removed due to feedback later on, see below. Use imutual link in first post)

But should this be to the benefit of imutual, or is this a grey area?

Are any referral earnings for the BigCrumbs going to the imutual coffers or to you personally.

If you personally, then the "benefit of imutual" topic we are voting on is not applicable.

If the referral link does go in the corporate coffers then feel free to delete my referral link, or tell me to.

Not that I expect many to join from my link, lately I feel a chill wind blowing through the forum, due to this very same type of competing for referrals problem.
Last edited by Squire on Thu Dec 20, 2012 11:57 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Another cashback site starts offering shares (sort of)

Post by richard@imutual » Thu Dec 20, 2012 5:12 pm

Do join up, by all means, and see if you can work out how to do UK offers :?

The imutual referral link - http://home.bigcrumbs.com/imutual - is at the beginning my my post. It benefits imutual - I never post personal referral links
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Re: Another cashback site starts offering shares (sort of)

Post by Squire » Thu Dec 20, 2012 5:45 pm

richard@imutual wrote:Do join up, by all means, and see if you can work out how to do UK offers :?

The imutual referral link - http://home.bigcrumbs.com/imutual - is at the beginning my my post. It benefits imutual - I never post personal referral links
OK, so I will remove my own referral link and point prospective members to the imutual one.

I have looked around, there are no "Daily Clicks" available.

No videos, no offerwall, no search merchants.

So unless they take action on my suggestion to them to add the aforementioned, this is going to be a dead loss to us imutual members.

Looks like one of the many "earn from purchases only" sites.

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Re: Another cashback site starts offering shares (sort of)

Post by ImutualLikeAPro » Thu Dec 20, 2012 6:29 pm

decided to ask on the forum
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Re: Another cashback site starts offering shares (sort of)

Post by ImutualLikeAPro » Fri Dec 21, 2012 5:05 pm

Here's the reply I recieved:

Hi BigCrumbsLikeAPro,

Thanks for your question. At this point, you are correct that we don't offer a lot of shopping options for our UK members. Previously, we had eBay.com and eBay.co.uk on board as the primary shopping destinations for our friends across the pond. Granted, even then there wasn't nearly as much shopping variety as we offer for our U.S. and Canadian members.

So, to some extent, we continue to maintain UK on the list of available countries for legacy purposes and, perhaps, for future additional shopping opportunities.

And, of course, members in the UK can still participate in our referral program, as well as earn cash for sharing various aspects of BigCrumbs, retailers, and their products. For instance, when you share a deal on FB or Twitter (using the respective icons beneath the deal), you can be paid!

Also, you can share a page from any participating retailer's website and be paid if it results in a purchase.

For more information, please see here:

http://www.bigcrumbs.com/crumbs/crumbBoosters.do
http://www.bigcrumbs.com/crumbs/sharePage.do.


Hope this helps!

Vince
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Re: Another cashback site starts offering shares (sort of)

Post by baxto » Fri Dec 28, 2012 4:03 am

Just wondering if you would mind disclosing the amount of shares given out to date for this site. Thanks :)
Don't worry I found it http://www.imutual.co.uk/report?id=651 :)

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